Wednesday, January 22, 2014

Nice Guys aren't actually Nice.... A Man's perspective

A man's perspective on "nice guys".... This was written by a friend of mine.. I think he gets it ;)

Nice Guys aren't actually Nice
Let us start at the beginning.  Why do we even talk about nice guys?  The reason is when asking a woman what she wants in a man she will almost invariably list “nice guy” as one of her criteria.   Then as sure as the Earth orbits the sun some guy will whine about how much of a nice guy he is and how he can never get the girl or how he's constantly “frienzoned”.  
First I want to talk about the criteria people use to choose there partners.  Nearly everyone in the universe wants to be with someone who is kind to them and treats them with respect, I would say it's closer to 100% than it is to 99% .  This goes for men and women.  Men even have a saying “No matter how hot she is, somebody else is tired of her shit.”  Which is just a way of saying “I'm only willing to put up with somebody who treats me poorly for so long no matter what other attributes that person has that appeal to me.”  Just like looks, niceness does not exist in a vacuum.   A woman doesn't like a guy simply because of niceness.  Everyone has a laundry list of things they like and don't like and niceness is just one of a myriad of criteria that an individual is using.   Nice may be at the top of the list or it may be in the middle it's likely the person themselves probability doesn't even know where exactly it falls.  The fact is, just being “nice” isn't enough.
Now let me get to the crux of what I'd like to talk about here.  If you've ever said anything to the effect of “I'm a nice guy but women (or insert girl name here) doesn't like me, wont go out with me, wont have sex with me blah blah.  I have some bad news for you, you're probably not a nice guy.
Let me explain
There seem to be some people out there who think that women are all liars and that they don't actually like nice guys.   They will usually site some example to the effect of “I tried to be a nice guy and I never got the girl then I started to be a jerk and I did much better with women, therefore women don't actually like nice guys.” 
Now I have no doubt that many so called “Nice guys” have stopped being “Nice guys” and done better with women.   However I going to break down a multitude of reasons why that's happening and none of them have anything to do with women lying about wanting nice guys or not wanting nice guys in general.
Men who stop being “Nice Guys” and do better with women were probably not nice guys to begin with.      These are people who have been spending their time trying to go through the motions of being nice, without actually being nice.   It's something sociopaths are very good at. Actual nice guys rarely self identify as nice, because they don't have to.   If you've ever claimed to be a nice guy, there is a high probability that you're not actually a nice.  If you've ever wondered why your “good deeds” didn't get you laid or get you a relationship or whatever you're not actually a nice guy, you were just going through the motions of being nice in an attempt to get what you wanted.  You were following a formula of deeds that you thought would get you laid or a relationship or whatever.
The difference between a fake nice guy and a real nice guy is simple.  Lets say a lady friend of yours runs out of gas on the highway and calls you and asks you to bring her gas.   Lets say our actual nice guy and our fake nice guy both do the exact same thing, bring her gas and then she drives off to go sleep with her boyfriend who you consider and asshole.   The actual nice guy will go back to doing whatever he was doing.  He may not even consider what he did to be nice, he may just consider it to be something friends do for each other and he expects nothing in return.   The fake nice guy watches her speed away and gets angry and he thinks about all the nice things he's done for her and she still wont sleep/date/kiss him whatever.   He thinks that at some point he will receive some reward for all the “good deeds” he's doing.   Really he's expecting return for the fake good deeds he's doing because they aren't actually good deeds out of the kindness of his heart, they are an investment, and he gets upset when he's not getting a return on that investment.   He is under the mistaken impression that a woman is like a slot machine and if he eventually puts in enough “nice guy” tokens he will finally win the jackpot.
There is an old saying “A good deed is it's own reward”.  If it's not its own reward, if it's simply a means to an end, then it's not actually a good deed.
So then our “Nice Guy” decides that since his lady friend is sleeping with some guy he considers to be an asshole, so he too should be an asshole! He has concluded that women have lied to him about wanting to be with a nice guy and to truly get the woman/women he desires he will be like that guy he hated, the asshole. He's in luck because he's probably already an asshole and he didn't hate the asshole his lady friend was sleeping with so much as he was jealous of him.   So with his new found self righteousness he will attempt to tread the path of the asshole so that he may stick his penis in all of the women that all those other assholes were getting.   He will disprove the myth of the nice guy through sexual conquest!

And it works

Sort of

A fake nice guy who decides to be an “asshole” will almost assuredly see an uptick in the attention he gets from women.   He then concludes that women are either liars or actually have no idea what they want and he's proven it by using the tactics that he, in all probability, disparaged while he was a “Nice Guy”.

but he's wrong
He's wrong about the reasons, he's doing better because he's more confident.  Confidence is a huge turn on for many many people.   In fact if he had he had more confidence while faking his nice routine he would have been in even better shape.  However he mistakenly believes that nice guy is synonymous with doormat. That it means always putting your own needs second to others, that it means not being assertive, and instead being submissive.   Confidence, persistence and assertiveness don't make you an asshole,  although many assholes tend to be both assertive and persistent.  Imagine what an assertive, confident nice guy could do!
Make no mistake, almost without exception women want nice guys.  If you're actually nice and you're having problems with women, the nice part is not the problem.  Remember though, being a nice guy isn't about what you don't do, so you don't hit women, so you don't run over animals, congrats your not a horrible human being but you're still not nice.  Just saying you're a nice guy is like AT&T saying their new phone won't explode and blow your head off.  That's great, but neither will this other phone and it has all these other features.....   Women haven't been lying to you.  You're just having a problem with correlation vs. causation.


  1. Adding to the male perspective - it's worth nothing that "nice" and "boring" are not mutually exclusive. Nice guys get sequestered to the friend zone for being boring - and can win back a whole lot of ground without letting go of an ounce of kindness by keeping things interesting and trying some unpredictability from time to time.

    1. I think both of you guys nailed it on the head. These points aside, people should get away from using the word "nice" to describe anyone. Someone who smiles all of the time is not necessarily "nice". They can be all sorts of warped with issues they carry internally. If both men and women describe their ideal mate in clearer terms (i.e., share similar sense of humor, dresses appropriate for his age and personality, is financially stable or contributes to society in a meaningful way, etc.) the caliber of people you meet tends to change to align with those intentions.

  2. Thanks so much for giving everyone a very superb possiblity to read from this blog.
    It is often very cool and packed with a good time for me and my office co-workers
    to sea your website at the least thrice weekly to read the new
    items you have. And of course, I'm always happy for the fantastic knowledge you serve. Some 3 points in this posting are honestly the most efficient I have ever had.
    Visit my website: SeniorJobNow

  3. has anybody considered that the guy is treating the woman better than other women because he is doing what is essentially a modern day mating ritual that is him saying "this is who i will be for you".

    That is not to say he treats other women poorly its just that they are not the focus of his attention or affection.

    Nobody treats their other friends as well as they treat their partner so i do not see why a guy who is turned down when he inquires about having a intimate relationship after making a extra effort would focus on that woman as much as he had been doing when initially presenting himself.

    That dedication and focus is quite rightly shifted to another woman and you are demoted in his affection down to the ranks with everybody else.

    Other types do exist who exploit such behavior but be sure to correctly identify each because it is not as simple as you make it sound, and lets not ignore the many women who are happy to knowingly milk all the benefits then discard the guy one he proposes a intimate relationship while using the "nice guy" meme to place all the blame on him.

    If you are not interested in a guy intimately do not accept the extra attention he gives you and make it clear you are not interested in a intimate relationship, anything else is exploiting his affection.